Trade Manifesto

So with the model you have selected, only the heavy traders, which is less than 10%, are the only people that are going to see all of the content that the game has to offer? How does that even make any sense? You spend countless hours as a team to service only a fraction of your player base and feel that’s a win?

I’m all for “earning” my way through the game but why should I have to be forced to be one of the 10% wasting all my gaming time flipping when I could be playing this great game?

There are so many other avenues you could have taken, like make high end items account bound and all the lower tier stuff tradable.

I have a hard time subscribing to your philosophy, but the 10%ers out there love it, I’m sure.
The Lab, making a great game good since 2016.
Last edited by Bowman8763 on Nov 6, 2017, 9:30:31 PM
"Keep trade arbitrarily difficult, frustrating and unfun. That will make players want to grind more levels."

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Last edited by xThothx on Nov 2, 2017, 11:50:49 PM
I'm glad you're sticking to your guns here and keeping that promise you've made about no buyouts.

with that said, we are now at a point where trading is already way too convenient. and you're the guys who made it too convenient

did you guys realize that when you rolled out the premium stash API?

even with forum scraping, there were surely some ways to identify and prevent massive scraping floods. hell, you always had hard limits on stash tab API calls.

there were ways to prevent trade becoming easier. but you didn't. instead you went for compromise which led you to the situation we have now. you're basically one step away from what you wanted to avoid at all costs - instant buyout. so of course many people are wondering why aren't you taking that final step.

if instead you've wanted to make trade inconvenient and let everyone know that, I I think you shouldnt have compromised so much in the first place.
I think, UX wise, the search results items are too big. This impedes the ability to quickly scan throw items and see more than 2 of them at the same time.

I'd suggest to drop the pretty icon presentation in favor of a simple text-based list. Color code the necessary important parts (name in color corresponding to rarity, damage modifiers by their elemental type, etc.)

Think of it as an online catalog, and the best practices are right there.

For instance -- filters should have probably be placed on the left hand size, if the viewport size allows, etc...
Nice work, team.

Its looks like a really good way to end price-fixing meta. Will be great to also have a karma/report button to have not-only personal way of disabling abusive players or price fixing/checking players.
For example negative karma counter with a way to filter offers by karma threshold and daily reset of this counter.
in this thread: a lot of people who want trade to be easier who are completely unable to grasp the idea that many people do not want to trade and will never do so, not because it takes you 30 seconds to alt tab to a browser, make a search and copy/paste the pm, but because they do not want to trade and would rather find the items they use.

Trading is so hard, it should be in game but instead I have to alt-tab, thats such a big deal, trading is restricted to the 1% because only they have the 14 hour a day playtimes needed to press alt-tab to get to the item search, omg this is a travesty....

...can we get some perspective in here? Yeah would be nice to have it in game and then they can shut down the data stream, wipe out 3rd party tools and just have the in game one. That would be nice, but all this "omg its so hard to trade 90% of players are gated out of it because tabing to a browser is such a big deal" stuff is laughable, no one with sense is buying that nonsense so just quit trying to sell it.
I do agree with the sentiment of many.

Trading is pretty inconvenient. I want to play and not have to actively sell just to be able to be even close to outfitting for end game content. I spend alot of time back and forth losing valuable playtime because I need to make a sale

Seems to me getting better drops would be the answer to that. I'd move to SSF right now if that was the case.

I sell items because I have to. If I don't I cant get to the end game content. I found that out the hard way after playing decently built toons but having crappy gear.

So I was -forced- to buy premium tabs (or go insane on the forums). I think one of the highest revenue share for GGG are the tabs. So why would they want an auction house type trading system in place...unless that went thru premium tabs as well.

Don't get me wrong I'd still support GGG even though they are "f2p" but a set of armor or effects imho are out of $$ range for many people. $40 usd for a set of armor or decent wings? too rich for my blood except for a one-time purchase.

I get their quandary - having trading become untenable and out of control to the point of people leaving the game, for whatever number of reasons is on their minds.

But from someone who would rather play (and find decent gear) than trade I feel trading should be either easier or the player should find better build specific gear for him or herself.

Great Builds [3.1] Used By Me or Guild Mates:
Check out Engineering Eternity on YT - no B.S. right to the point reference videos, and more! Good Stuff...
Thanks for making the page for 19" and above screens only, probably 22" minimum.
My bad for being poor and playing on a piece of shit that's *NOT* a basic gamer twitch dual 50" setup.

I have to scroll down every time to see the fucking search button.
And no I won't resize the page and fuck all my shit up for that.
Can't you move the search button up or add another one up ?

The search and clear button cross function, making them show up and vanish willy nilly....

"Players can now smack around players who are having trouble very early on."
Last edited by Elemenz on Nov 3, 2017, 12:38:37 AM
Chris I really hope you read all the posts in this thread that show you and GGG have your trading philosophy the wrong way around.

I disagree with basically every conclusion you have for easy trading.

What happens for me is I play for a week or a couple weeks, hit the wall around tear 5 Maps and quit the league because I cant upgrade my gear to progress.

Easier gear acquisition through instant trading would mean I can progress through the content and play the game much Much MUCH longer. I've been playing since 2012 and I've never seen most of the end game content because getting the gear is just to time consuming, tedious and difficult.

I want to be able to trade for gear without having to deal with a person at all.
Ascension tied to Lab is the worst thing GGG has done...apart from GGG's philosophy on Trading. Oh and Gambling Loot boxes. And selling out to tencent.

I used to love GGG. I supported to ensure GGG remained independent, now I just wish I could get my money back. -_-

Took me a while to realize wtf is going on...
And you worked on this A YEAR? A FUCKING YEAR?
Would it have killed your team to check with someone like me outside your echo chamber to avoid this?

You hit clear and it just wipes the page, then you hit search not knowing wtf you're even searching for and it shows RANDOM shit... then you hit the expand drop arrow next to clear, and it fucking teleports the search and clear buttons down...


I'm not a designer, I have ZERO EDUCATION or programming skills and lack any merits in this field,
but even in spite of all that, EVEN *I* am able to tell you with common sense:

You keep the fucking button bar LOCKED IN PLACE,
so that when you TOGGLE the expand/collapse arrow, said bar with the (search/clear) buttons


"Players can now smack around players who are having trouble very early on."

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