Wolcen Hype Release!

You know, multiple things can be true at the same time.

Wolcen is fun. It's a mess, but I'm enjoying it. (I'm not duping gold, or abusing bleeding edge modifier, or 100% Block and Efficeny shenanigans)

There is absolutely no reason to have animosity towards other games in a genre. PoE will be fine. Wolcen most likely will, at the very least, survive a few iterations. Diablo 4 and Torchlight will have their time (we wont talk about Last Epoch)

Spoiler
Chris Wilson...is...well something. I love to play armchair psychologist, but I'm on thin fucking ice forum probation wise, so I will pass for now. I will say that he has "evolved" over the last few years.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln
"
DarthSki44 wrote:
There is absolutely no reason to have animosity towards other games in a genre. PoE will be fine. Wolcen most likely will, at the very least, survive a few iterations.


It's not about "other games in a genre". PoE players themselves have frequently lamented the lack of serious competition and wished the genre had more (good) options. It's more about a trend in game development in general. In this case, yes Wolcen is yet another game that released an unfinished product - and yes, every PoE league typically feels like that too (though not to this extent) - but there's also more to it than that. You're here getting defensive about all the backlash, but what preceded that backlash?

Hype. Including here. And hype and anger are two sides of the same coin.

If games didn't sell themselves on hype and pre-purchase/day 1 purchases to begin with, they wouldn't face as much premature anger either. If game sales were a more slow and steady curve from release to a few months to years after release, you wouldn't have so many people piling onto them for good or ill.

But they aren't. And Wolcen in specific isn't innocent in this regard either. It did try to aggressively encourage early buy-ins. It had a lot of sponsored marketing and streaming. But even more egregiously, it forced you to choose between buying in early for an uncertain product or be penalized for being more patient by having to pay 50% more. If their servers couldn't handle all the traffic, they have only themselves to blame - not simply for not buying more server capacity, but also for seeking out those kind of Day 1 numbers to begin with.

They could have done this differently - let reviews and streams come out on their own, let players come to the game on their own terms. But no. They CHOSE to embrace some of the shittiest business practices the industry has today. And so if they're going to try to benefit from those practices, they should not be immune to the backlash such practices generate when things go wrong.
[quote="Qarl"]Fixed a bug where occasionally Fairgraves, Neverdying never dies[/quote]
You posted the same thing in the other thread.

1. No one is forced to do anything at all, ever. That's absurd. Purchase or dont. If your patience and judgement is swayed by $10, then I'd say it wasnt worth much to begin with.

2. $30 going to $40 isnt a 50% increase. (Price for many months)

3. Many, many games, incentivize early access, beta keys, cosmetics and collectibles, and all kinds of other shit to get people to come and try, and help fund development.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln
"
Xystre wrote:
"
Oh, the irony of a Tencent supporter sermonising on cash-grabs.

ANYWAY.

QFT.

They would rather pay $25 for a reskinned HO that took no time to create cuz it was in game already or $35 armors cuz poe rocks, be a good goy and support!

but an entire game for $25? (not sure how much is wolcen sorry) nope.. that will infuriate tggg loyalists.


Uh huh. So you're speaking without even knowing the price of the product you're speaking on? Real valid perspective here. Wolcen is $40, btw. And it was $30. They bumped up the price to encourage pre-sales. That's why people call it a cash grab.
[quote="Qarl"]Fixed a bug where occasionally Fairgraves, Neverdying never dies[/quote]
Last edited by Exile009 on Feb 20, 2020, 3:55:50 PM
"
DarthSki44 wrote:
You posted the same thing in the other thread.

1. No one is forced to do anything at all, ever. That's absurd. Purchase or dont. If your patience and judgement is swayed by $10, then I'd say it wasnt worth much to begin with.

2. $30 going to $40 isnt a 50% increase. (Price for many months)

3. Many, many games, incentivize early access, beta keys, cosmetics and collectibles, and all kinds of other shit to get people to come and try, and help fund development.


You have this strange tendency to be both libertarian and not at the same time. Of course I'm free not to buy. I'm also free to buy, be disappointed and call them out for it. You're free to respond to that. You're also free to not to. So what? What's the point saying "purchase or dont"? The point is they made it such that early purchases were heavily favored (that better?). I could just turn around and say reply or don't. You're free not to, after all. It's your argument that's absurd. Because it isn't an argument at all. It's just intentionally missing the point.

And Wolcen using the same shitty tactics as other games is also hardly a defense. Did I suggest it was unique? I explicitly explained it as another example of a more pervasive problem. And it's not like Wolcen is being singled out or treated differently. No Man's Sky faced plenty of backlash when it messed up, for example (and there's plenty of other examples). If anything, companies being constantly called out for their bullshit is a good thing. It's you who's seemingly expecting Wolcen to be an exception to that rule.
[quote="Qarl"]Fixed a bug where occasionally Fairgraves, Neverdying never dies[/quote]
"
Oh, the irony of a Tencent supporter sermonising on cash-grabs.

ANYWAY.

Deeply enjoying the tactical possibilities of Evasion. Kind of brilliant of them to make it dash in the opposite direction of the cursor. I've taken down much stronger enemies than I could merely facetank just by learning their attack patterns and using a mix of Evasion and the dodge-roll. Satisfying!

"
Xavderion wrote:
Pulling off a cool character name is a big part of the fun of naming characters in PoE. Sense of pride and accomplishment™.


Hardly something at which I need to prove myself more than accomplished. :) I like the idea of making a Musashi, a Thor, a Legolas, and maybe even a Geralt!


Tencent invested into Wolcen Studio a few years ago as part of their Games without Border project.
Enough to pay for almost 40 people and multiple major reworks apparently.

GGG had around 30 people when they officialy released POE back in 2013.

So Wolcen Studio is not the small indie dev you (not you personally) think it is, when comparing studio size and funding.

Wolcen Studio long term plans are similar to POE's ones.
Free expansions and mainly cosmetic MTX to pay for maintenance/expansions or bigger feature patches.
Granted they implement game mechanics to entice people to come back every few months/quarters for constant revenue streams.

The honeymoon phase will be over in less than a month and i hope the initial revenue stream will be enough for their planned (have they any?) short term improvements.

"
Exile009 wrote:
"
DarthSki44 wrote:
You posted the same thing in the other thread.

1. No one is forced to do anything at all, ever. That's absurd. Purchase or dont. If your patience and judgement is swayed by $10, then I'd say it wasnt worth much to begin with.

2. $30 going to $40 isnt a 50% increase. (Price for many months)

3. Many, many games, incentivize early access, beta keys, cosmetics and collectibles, and all kinds of other shit to get people to come and try, and help fund development.


You have this strange tendency to be both libertarian and not at the same time. Of course I'm free not to buy. I'm also free to buy, be disappointed and call them out for it. You're free to respond to that. You're also free to not to. So what? What's the point saying "purchase or dont"? The point is they made it such that early purchases were heavily favored (that better?). I could just turn around and say reply or don't. You're free not to, after all. It's your argument that's absurd. Because it isn't an argument at all. It's just intentionally missing the point.

And Wolcen using the same shitty tactics as other games is also hardly a defense. Did I suggest it was unique? I explicitly explained it as another example of a more pervasive problem. And it's not like Wolcen is being singled out or treated differently. No Man's Sky faced plenty of backlash when it messed up, for example (and there's plenty of other examples). If anything, companies being constantly called out for their bullshit is a good thing. It's you who's seemingly expecting Wolcen to be an exception to that rule.


Still doesnt address your points at all.

You said people were forced to choose. They were not. They made decisions. If it was worth 30 to them, maybe it would be worth 40. If not then they wait. What exactly is your problem here? People wait for sales, discounts, complete editions, all the time. No one was penalized or forced to do anything. That's a ridiculous conclusion (and it wasnt a 50% increase)

And no one is saying Wolcen shouldn't be reviewed or criticized. Cmon. All I was saying is do it fairly, and accurately.

Is the game a mess with mechanics and online server issues? Yes 100%.

Have the Devs crossed the line with unprecedented shady tactics and predatory behavior? Gimme a break.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but your seemingly presented shock and disgust with Wolcen gets nothing but an eyeroll from me. Idk maybe you are just the review-bomb type. If so, go ahead and live your best life.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln
Last edited by DarthSki44 on Feb 20, 2020, 5:16:58 PM
I wouldn't worry. Gamers don't forget and don't forgive. If those guys want to do something else down the line there will not be such high sales because burn me once etc.
"
Johny_Snow wrote:
I wouldn't worry. Gamers don't forget and don't forgive. If those guys want to do something else down the line there will not be such high sales because burn me once etc.


Lol if only that were true. See EA, Activision, Blizzard, etc..

Gamers 100% do this, and D4 for example, will sell at insane levels.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln
Hah, like these fools are at the same level to have decades old franchises which were good once and ready to be milked. It is one game, first impression. If it is bad you lose future sales.
Last edited by Johny_Snow on Feb 20, 2020, 5:42:05 PM

Report Forum Post

Report Account:

Report Type

Additional Info