PS4 servers are undergoing maintenance. Some features will be unavailable.

[3.12] Remi's Toxic Rain Pathfinder | Beginner guide | All Content | Fast, Strong and Easy to play

Somewhat thinking out loud here, but seems like Dying Sun would be amazingly powerful to fit in. With a few more levels, picking up Primal Spirit and Arcane Chemistry and getting 9% flask effect from the belt would get you to 50% increased flask effect for 3 additional arrows from Dying Sun. Plus, with a decently rolled one scaled by the flask effect, you could get another 35+% AoE to help those additional arrows overlap. None of the other flasks are easy to drop though. I don't know the right answer, but wouldn't it be nice to just have 6 slots haha.
"
rlauren2 wrote:
Somewhat thinking out loud here, but seems like Dying Sun would be amazingly powerful to fit in. With a few more levels, picking up Primal Spirit and Arcane Chemistry and getting 9% flask effect from the belt would get you to 50% increased flask effect for 3 additional arrows from Dying Sun. Plus, with a decently rolled one scaled by the flask effect, you could get another 35+% AoE to help those additional arrows overlap. None of the other flasks are easy to drop though. I don't know the right answer, but wouldn't it be nice to just have 6 slots haha.


Problem with dying sun is it adds +2 arrows. As I've tested and stated above, more projectiles will make the arrows spread further out, making overlapping between the pods insanely hard (though need further testing on how much each projectile spread).

Though the flask does give some inc area, but I don't think it is enough for the spreaded arrows to all overlap on each other.

But yeah this needs a lot of further testing and stuff cus I haven't tested about the flask effect. But tldr dying sun might decrease your dps instead.
I cast remi - a very beginner friendly guide : https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2866127
Support me if you want to! ttv/remicaster1
"
Remicaster1 wrote:
"
rlauren2 wrote:
Somewhat thinking out loud here, but seems like Dying Sun would be amazingly powerful to fit in. With a few more levels, picking up Primal Spirit and Arcane Chemistry and getting 9% flask effect from the belt would get you to 50% increased flask effect for 3 additional arrows from Dying Sun. Plus, with a decently rolled one scaled by the flask effect, you could get another 35+% AoE to help those additional arrows overlap. None of the other flasks are easy to drop though. I don't know the right answer, but wouldn't it be nice to just have 6 slots haha.


Problem with dying sun is it adds +2 arrows. As I've tested and stated above, more projectiles will make the arrows spread further out, making overlapping between the pods insanely hard (though need further testing on how much each projectile spread).

Though the flask does give some inc area, but I don't think it is enough for the spreaded arrows to all overlap on each other.

But yeah this needs a lot of further testing and stuff cus I haven't tested about the flask effect. But tldr dying sun might decrease your dps instead.

Yeah, I understand that more arrows widens the overall landing area. What's unclear is whether it keeps the overall density constant.

Basically, if you have enough AoE to make 4/5 pods touch you before adding more arrows, then add 4 more arrows, would it just be 4/9 pods that touch you? If so, your damage hasn't gone down, but your coverage area is just much wider. If adding those 4 arrows widens the landing area at a rate too high and makes it so that only 3/9 pods now touch you, that would obviously be bad.

It really just sucks that GGG doesn't give out any official info about the mechanics/formulas of the skill. It would be so much cleaner if we could calculate breakpoints using math like cast on crit.
"
rlauren2 wrote:
"
Remicaster1 wrote:
"
rlauren2 wrote:
Somewhat thinking out loud here, but seems like Dying Sun would be amazingly powerful to fit in. With a few more levels, picking up Primal Spirit and Arcane Chemistry and getting 9% flask effect from the belt would get you to 50% increased flask effect for 3 additional arrows from Dying Sun. Plus, with a decently rolled one scaled by the flask effect, you could get another 35+% AoE to help those additional arrows overlap. None of the other flasks are easy to drop though. I don't know the right answer, but wouldn't it be nice to just have 6 slots haha.


Problem with dying sun is it adds +2 arrows. As I've tested and stated above, more projectiles will make the arrows spread further out, making overlapping between the pods insanely hard (though need further testing on how much each projectile spread).

Though the flask does give some inc area, but I don't think it is enough for the spreaded arrows to all overlap on each other.

But yeah this needs a lot of further testing and stuff cus I haven't tested about the flask effect. But tldr dying sun might decrease your dps instead.

Yeah, I understand that more arrows widens the overall landing area. What's unclear is whether it keeps the overall density constant.

Basically, if you have enough AoE to make 4/5 pods touch you before adding more arrows, then add 4 more arrows, would it just be 4/9 pods that touch you? If so, your damage hasn't gone down, but your coverage area is just much wider. If adding those 4 arrows widens the landing area at a rate too high and makes it so that only 3/9 pods now touch you, that would obviously be bad.

It really just sucks that GGG doesn't give out any official info about the mechanics/formulas of the skill. It would be so much cleaner if we could calculate breakpoints using math like cast on crit.


Each arrow is landed in a circular area, which is similar to Rain of Arrow. Additional Toxic Rain arrow increases the number of the outer ring, thus increasing the spreading of the initial shot accordingly. With that in mind, for each +1 arrow, you should make an additional increase of AoE if you want to keep the same overlap from pod explosion as prior to th addition of arrow.
Poison Scourge Arrow/Toxic Rain + Blast Rain PF| Bottled Fortify:
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2851574
--
Last edited by WolfieNa on May 29, 2020, 11:55:25 PM
from what I've tested, the arrow spread is actually massive, by having +1 arrow, you need about 35-50% (not too sure) increase aoe to maintain that overlap. Yes, it is maintain, not additional overlap.

I cast remi - a very beginner friendly guide : https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2866127
Support me if you want to! ttv/remicaster1
Last edited by Remicaster1 on May 30, 2020, 2:33:45 AM
First of all, well written guide that even as an experienced player I learned a fair bit from. One thing I would suggest however is to take the leveling paths and put them in PoB as well so it's easier to find them. I actually messed around with the build in PoB a bit first and made my own leveling path before I finished reading the guide and saw you had pretty much the same path as I did there. As the end build is not very leveling friendly with most of the damage being centered around the cluster jewels, so just gotta make sure people can easily find the leveling tree.

I'm still deciding what build to league start but I preferably want to do it as pathfinder so just looking at the various options. My initial plan was cobra lash or viper strike as the later is what I played to 100 and I really like it but I'm not too sure how it will be without some investment so toxic rain may be a better starting option.

I guess the question is also whether quill rain or crafted bow will be better to start out with. Obviously quill in the beginning but getting the exalts to get a crafted bow should not take too long while corruptions may still be quite rare at the start of the league.

Also would you use caustic arrow together with toxic rain at some point for more single target? I haven't played much toxic rain yet(pretty much only chaos skill I haven't) but would it not be similar to essence drain with blight where you just keep up the caustic arrow/ed and then use the toxic rain/blight as those are not limited to 1. Especially with all the skill duration you shouldn't need to use caustic arrow very often.

Of course all this comes down to the patch notes as well as all the non poison chaos skills really benefited hugely from all the easy to get dot multi and skill duration that cluster jewels give.
"
Remicaster1 wrote:
from what I've tested, the arrow spread is actually massive, by having +1 arrow, you need about 35-50% (not too sure) increase aoe to maintain that overlap. Yes, it is maintain, not additional overlap.


I had an unscientific go at it: Video

As best I can tell by just standing in my hideout and looking at it to the naked eye, adding more arrows causes the additional ones to land in outer "orbits", but doesn't really seem to cause the close arrows to be pushed away.

With 50% inc. aoe, 3 pods always would touch whatever spot I clicked my mouse (my character in the video), no matter if I had 5 arrows or 13. With 100% aoe, 4 pods would touch my mouse click, again no matter 5 arrows or 13, etc.

More arrows won't help your boss DPS since they land far away, but they won't hurt it either. The close arrows still land close.

"
rlauren2 wrote:
"
Remicaster1 wrote:
from what I've tested, the arrow spread is actually massive, by having +1 arrow, you need about 35-50% (not too sure) increase aoe to maintain that overlap. Yes, it is maintain, not additional overlap.


I had an unscientific go at it: Video

As best I can tell by just standing in my hideout and looking at it to the naked eye, adding more arrows causes the additional ones to land in outer "orbits", but doesn't really seem to cause the close arrows to be pushed away.

With 50% inc. aoe, 3 pods always would touch whatever spot I clicked my mouse (my character in the video), no matter if I had 5 arrows or 13. With 100% aoe, 4 pods would touch my mouse click, again no matter 5 arrows or 13, etc.

More arrows won't help your boss DPS since they land far away, but they won't hurt it either. The close arrows still land close.



if you notice it (from naked eye)
when the video starts (no +proj), the pods are either 3 overlaps or 4 overlaps
when you equipped the helmet, you noticed that the 4th overlap happens way less often
When you equipped the death opus and so on, you could notice the overlap is either 2 or 3

but this test can't really be confirmed cus sometimes you think your pod hits the monster (looks like it overlapped) but it actually did not. Best is to try on a monster with decent hitbox (for example the beach boss) then test the overlap there.
I cast remi - a very beginner friendly guide : https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2866127
Support me if you want to! ttv/remicaster1
Last edited by Remicaster1 on May 31, 2020, 3:08:24 AM
"
fleckens wrote:
First of all, well written guide that even as an experienced player I learned a fair bit from. One thing I would suggest however is to take the leveling paths and put them in PoB as well so it's easier to find them. I actually messed around with the build in PoB a bit first and made my own leveling path before I finished reading the guide and saw you had pretty much the same path as I did there. As the end build is not very leveling friendly with most of the damage being centered around the cluster jewels, so just gotta make sure people can easily find the leveling tree.

I'm still deciding what build to league start but I preferably want to do it as pathfinder so just looking at the various options. My initial plan was cobra lash or viper strike as the later is what I played to 100 and I really like it but I'm not too sure how it will be without some investment so toxic rain may be a better starting option.

I guess the question is also whether quill rain or crafted bow will be better to start out with. Obviously quill in the beginning but getting the exalts to get a crafted bow should not take too long while corruptions may still be quite rare at the start of the league.

Also would you use caustic arrow together with toxic rain at some point for more single target? I haven't played much toxic rain yet(pretty much only chaos skill I haven't) but would it not be similar to essence drain with blight where you just keep up the caustic arrow/ed and then use the toxic rain/blight as those are not limited to 1. Especially with all the skill duration you shouldn't need to use caustic arrow very often.

Of course all this comes down to the patch notes as well as all the non poison chaos skills really benefited hugely from all the easy to get dot multi and skill duration that cluster jewels give.


Thanks for your compliment and glad you learnt something =p.
About the leveling tree on PoB, I think most people would end up skipping them so I didn't really bothered on setting a new tree for it cus it is quite time consuming to do all of that in a single PoB. So I decided that I won't be setting them up on the PoB

I use caustic arrow for early on the league when I don't have a Quill Rain, just to increase the clear. I wouldn't be using Caustic after I got a quill rain because you'd just decrease your dps when you tried to fire a CA on the boss. Though the damage is there, but it is just not that great unfortunately.

For league start situation, I've league started as toxic rain on this league but I didn't stayed for long and transition into another build for the early league delve race, but from what I can tell is Quill Rain really helps. Lioneye's Paws also help on the early stages of the game where you can put in a withering touch setup and it deals a ton of damage.
I cast remi - a very beginner friendly guide : https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2866127
Support me if you want to! ttv/remicaster1
Last edited by Remicaster1 on May 31, 2020, 3:14:18 AM
"
Remicaster1 wrote:


Thanks for your compliment and glad you learnt something =p.
About the leveling tree on PoB, I think most people would end up skipping them so I didn't really bothered on setting a new tree for it cus it is quite time consuming to do all of that in a single PoB. So I decided that I won't be setting them up on the PoB

I use caustic arrow for early on the league when I don't have a Quill Rain, just to increase the clear. I wouldn't be using Caustic after I got a quill rain because you'd just decrease your dps when you tried to fire a CA on the boss. Though the damage is there, but it is just not that great unfortunately.

For league start situation, I've league started as toxic rain on this league but I didn't stayed for long and transition into another build for the early league delve race, but from what I can tell is Quill Rain really helps. Lioneye's Paws also help on the early stages of the game where you can put in a withering touch setup and it deals a ton of damage.


Yeah that's fair, I guess it's probably true that new players are just as if not more likely to see the beginner trees in the guide than in PoB, it's just important to emphasise the use of those builds to start with as the difference between going the endgame setup where the start is just life vs full damage is pretty massive early on when you don't have any other modifiers to your damage. I actually did practice runs with the two different versions just to see how big a difference it is and it's pretty much the difference between feeling like you do no damage and bosses taking forever to everything just dying around you from mirage archer and bosses only taking a few seconds.

I'm taking the good build and leveling it further just for some league start practice(and because I'm bored and want to play PoE) to see how it will do. In ssf though so won't be quite the same as league start but I tend to not trade much early on anyway. I added short bows to my filter and using all my chance orbs on those just for the higher chance of getting the quill rain early while in trade I will probably just buy it.

Slightly off topic but I'm curious, what build did you switch to for delving? I'm quite enjoying delve myself, got to around 700 with my viper strike pathfinder and then did a bit of zhp as storm brand. Only around 50 more levels down to 750 as I mostly practiced bosses. Probably planning on doing something similar this league and just hoping they don't nerf cluster jewel stacking as the storm brand build relies pretty heavily on that for longer attachment range.

Report Forum Post

Report Account:

Report Type

Additional Info