I tested it first on a level l5l Nemesis ranger and the main problem at the moment is the penalty on the skill.
You start with 40% of the base dmg and 33% less attack speed.
Which should be compensated by the additional physical dmg per lvl but the skill should work allready at the beginning and not in late game.
Default attack = 42.1 DPS (1x 14-47 dmg)
Barrage = 11.5 DPS (4x 6-19 combined dmg)
Burning arrow = 56.6 DPS (1x 19-63 dmg)
Split arrow = 35.2 DPS (4x 12-39 combined dmg)
Split arrow as alternative do more dmg per arrow and on top of it I can choose the cone size and get all projectiles out at the same time.
You can clear the first act nemesis with Default attack faster and safer as with Barrage which I think wasn't the intend of the Game Designer who invented this skill.
My suggestion is to lower the penalties of the skill and rebalance the late game by the per lvl dmg improvement.
I also tested the skill with a lvl 51 ranger and combined the skill with all kind of support gems to figure out what could be a good catalyst.
Faster projectiles, LMP/GMP, Chain and Point blank are good one but the penalties of Barrage are to high to get it on a level like Split arrow or Burning arrow.
The current build I'm testing is focusing on Point Blank first, King of the hill second and then Iron Reflexes.
I take all survival nodes I can reach and try to get as fast as possible to Iron Reflexes.
I want also to test if burst dmg with crit on short range suite more then flat dmg provided by physical dmg node.
Last edited by TAK2004 on Dec 13, 2013, 7:51:11 PM
on Dec 13, 2013, 7:48:08 PM
ive been playing with it for a while now, and i feel that if its to be viable at end game, your going to need an insane phys bow.
im currently at lvl 56 with it dealing around 150dps with pointblank
heres my gem set up, bow and passives i have atm
im not rich in currency so i cant get a good bow to test it highest dmg output, but from what ive played with, its dmg is so low when compared to other skill gems, and since its best used for shotgunning single targets the dmg isnt remotely comparable to other single target gems.
the spray of fire isnt anything to be glorified, it just gets in your way as the aoe potential is little to nothing. if the intention was to make it viable for semi-aoe and more viable for shotgunning, i would recommend reworking the skill entirely.
my suggestion would be remove the gem from the game and re-implement it to be like a ranged version of the muti strike support gem, where it auto targets additional enemies. additionally, imo i think that it should have a base phys range on the skill itself, allowing to use alternative bows and uniques for interesting combinations - i feel like the dependance on a good bow limits most players like myself, and with the recent full release the new players would benefit from it greatly.
on Dec 13, 2013, 10:06:59 PM
This gem just have to shoot 10 projectiles instead of 4. Even if reducing the damage per shot, it would have its place in the skill bar.
Right now, its outclassed by frenzy, power siphon, split arrow, you-name-it proj skill. Barrage has no identity, no roll to fulfil.
on Dec 14, 2013, 12:31:33 AM
2/10 skill unfortunately
Wander feedback only
using wands there are only 3 options:
- power siphon
- elemental hit
- not so bad auto attack (yes, i know)
a) power siphon
- build in culling strike (one less link needed)
- 125% base
- levels grant phys dmg, quality grants proj dmg
- power charge on kill (while wands both need crit chance and PC count due to notable)
- good single target
- generates frenzy charges
- bonus upgrades itself
- full usefulness at lvl1, requires no leveling (important for wanders due to low dex in most builds)
c) elemental hit
- amazing when you have mana for it.. after 1.0 butchering no longer viable if not directly specced into and even then it means serious gear compromises to sustain it
d) auto attack - with fast wand gets all your aura bonuses and is FREE. ofc not recommended but it does it job in a pinch (like 50% regen maps)
and now barrage..
- long casting delay (dangerous in a pinch!)
- phys dmg split into small chunks (armor says hi!)
- bad leveling and quality bonus
- dex based
- only useful at close range (aoe 'component' is absolutely terrible RNG)
- if just one proj miss - less effective vs single targets than all alternatives (even including ele dmg scaling)
it has no place in wand build: you use PS for AOE (and to get PC) and frenzy to get FC (attack speed)/single target. barrage in current form has no niche to fill and is plain less effective (ignoring paper dps) than other options. LGoH can work with that but if this is the only reason - you are in troubles anyway
- leveling scales proj dmg instead only phys dmg
- every 5 or 7 levels one proj is added
Last edited by sidtherat on Dec 15, 2013, 10:09:03 AM
on Dec 14, 2013, 4:15:13 PM
Its a great spell when your gear deal higher damage per hit, instead of damage per second.
on Dec 15, 2013, 7:31:44 PM
im specced into ele wand setup: ele jewelry, anger/wrath, all ele nodes, very fast wand with effective 75%crit chance
and still auto attack performs better. that 'less damage' + wind up really hurts this skill. no innate bonus (like frenzy) also hurts..
but - if anyone can provide good example of how to use it - im all ears
ps. ofc ignoring CoCS build..
on Dec 15, 2013, 9:31:08 PM
After playing with the gem from both weapon choices for a while, I think I could give some feedback here
TLDR; the drawback is big, but after some adjustment, it could be a good skill.
I'd not speak about how the gem itself alone is bad, since in that way, all the gems are bad and not effective.
Since Barrage is usable for bows and wands, sure enough, I'd have to emphasize on the weapon strong point, which is crit for wand, and raw attack power for bow. However we'd have already known this, Barrage on wand is best with cast on crit. Though I didn't play that far on the CoCS EK Barrage Wander, so cannot comment on that much.
Though, I do feel that Barrage Wander is quite nice with dual wielding since we get more attack speed bonus to counter the speed penalty from the gem itself. And the dual wield nodes in shadow is quite a good shortcut to cross to the other side of the shadow's tree (crit to attack speed, or vice versa).
This made me reroll into a dual wielding Duelist since I think he got some quite nice nodes for Barrage....
And... OH MY, certain Keystone, to name it out, POINT BLANK, make this skill become a beast.
No, it's not about how dual wielding wander is great. It's the BOW Barrager, which I shall name it : Machine Gun Turret.
So Barrage has
: slow attack speed
: low based damage
: cannot move during the whole period of firing
To counter it, we need to
: faster attack speed
: some way to buff the damage
: from #1, need faster attack to move away faster
So I decided to go IIR early, to be able to tank the damage a bit. I started of as a Split Arrows Bower, and use Barrage as a close range single target.
Then I start testing Barrage with available gems after arriving at act 3, normal.
This is quite ok since I could get some more AoE from the skill, without loosing damage too much. though the aplit angle is quite unreliable, so it got ditched away.
Now, this is where Barrage starting to shine in Act 3 normal. YES, Chain got a damage penalty in it. But, the bouncing back arrows has given me more overall damage. I was using this not so good bow, yet Chained Barrage started to overcome Split Arrows...
Kind of optional, but after putting in LGoH and Chain, the mana usage start to grow (~30 mana). This come to fix the problem. Mana usage become ~50-60, which is big for ~800 life pool. So come the next gem..
Life Gain on Hit:
This is... destined to be with Barrage. Say I gain 20 life per hit. Barrage hit 4 time in 0.6 seconds (after taking some attack speed nodes). And the chained arrow would give me roughly ... 150 life per usage, which is about almost 1/5 of the life pool, in 0.6 seconds, and totally counter the draining from Blood Magic, and kept my life full most of the time.
At first, I plan the character to be CoCS EK, so I was leveling up Hatred for that purpose, running it 24/7 since I don't need much mana for Barrage. Although, the unexpected weapon choice make me switched to a Bower instead.]
This is optional, and times to times got turn on/off when I drove into a lot of smaller mobs. It's not bad to have some extra protection while i was standing firing at mobs.
I was using this during the whole A2 - A3 normal
After a while, I switched to the Death Harp bow when I arrive at Dock. The additional arrow means 25% more damage, which is nice (and during this time, I added the Chain to the slot).
The big physical damage scaled up more with Hatred, and resulted in ... around 60 damage per arrow (after Chain penaly), which combined to 300 damage on one target, not counting chained.
Then I notice this little beast in my stash.
Bam, damage went up to 100 damage / hit, which is 400 damage on one damage, or more when chained
So I decided to .... have a single target version of Barrage, with
Barrage + Added Fire damage + LGoH + Point blank
Listed damage jumped to 250 / each, equal to 1000 / volley, and more at point blank. AT level 35, All the rares mob melt in 1-2 volley (literraly 1 second). Piety down in 6-7 volley, Dommy took longer (~20 or so) but no problem since I could leech back from LGoH. And the Point Blank works wonder since 80% of the time, I was shooting mobs in their face. Even the AoE with Chain version got a lot of damage boost. Moreover, Barrage is more effective at close range...
And that, is without any bow damage nodes. I did take a few projectile damage nodes in Duelist and one in Ranger, but only that...
To go even further, I took the Point Blank node after seeing the effect from the gem. Brutus down in... 4 round. Now cruising through Act 1 Cruel. I'll report in more after ... maybe act 3.
Current tree @ level 41
Not so OP equipments (All self found).
To sum it up:
- I need increase attack speed node, to compensate the drawbacks.
- I need damage nodes, with decent phys bow to scale the damage. (I don't have a good elemental bow, so not sure how it going to works.)
- Only a Barrage alone is not enough. I need 2 barrages for AoE and single target, or use 2 skills. But Split arrows was performing worse in my case, so I pick 2 Barrages.
- Reflect is not much a problem since I could switch between higher damage one, or lower damage AoE. And I could lower my damage further by shooting from the edge of screen.
- The main threat would be Lightning thorn, but (maybe) single target version could handle it.
Last edited by twintales on Dec 16, 2013, 11:13:03 AM
on Dec 16, 2013, 7:06:14 AM
Consumes frenzy charges, does 40% increased damage per frenzy charge consumed.
Quality bonus is reduced channeling time.
on Dec 16, 2013, 6:50:23 PM
BINGO! Id even go for 'more projectiles per frenzy charge' or 'more damage' or something similar.
and it plays well with frenzy+wander anyway (or am I the only one using frenzy as wander?)
barrage currently - to put it simply - is not attractive (Except chin sol + point blank - but even this has to take into account low dmg of that bow..)
on Dec 16, 2013, 7:15:13 PM
Шось? (IGN: Owner)
on Dec 16, 2013, 8:26:21 PM